“I work and who will reverse it?”

The question below was asked of me one time, and what follows was my reply.

“What if someone becomes a Christian but at some point decides they want to be an atheist and renounces his faith? I know your answer will be then they never were a Christian!”
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Please read God’s words below slowly and thoughtfully. If you have to, pray over His promises. Yes, you are correct of what my answer will be. So then, the question is - are we forced to call God a liar?

I John 2:19, 25 - “They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest (known), that none of them were of us...And this is THE PROMISE that He has promised US—eternal life.”

“I will make with them an EVERLASTING COVENANT, that I will not turn away from DOING GOOD TO THEM. And I will put the fear of Me IN THEIR HEARTS, that they WILL NOT turn from Me.” (Jer.32:40). This is when the Gospel comes into the mind - but also enters the heart.

"Now the JUST shall live by faith; BUT, if anyone draws back, My soul has no pleasure in him. But WE, (the just), ARE NOT of those WHO DRAW BACK TO PERDITION, but of THOSE WHO BELIEVE TO THE SAVING OF THE SOUL.” (Heb. 10:38). "...whom HE CALLED, these He also justified" (Rom.8: 30).

The elect are REDEEMED by Christ, RENEWED by the Spirit, but also KEPT IN FAITH by the almighty power of God. All those who are spiritually united to Christ through regeneration are eternally secure in Him. NOTHING can separate them from the eternal and unchangeable love of God. They have been PREDESTINED TO ETERNAL GLORY and so they are assured of heaven (predestined means predetermined).

Many who profess to believe fall away, but they do not fall from grace, for they were never in grace. True believers do fall into temptations, and they do commit grievous sins, but these sins do not cause them to lose their salvation OR SEPARATE THEM FROM CHRIST, for they have been SET APART forever, and will return to their Shepherd.

They ARE KEPT BY GOD’S POWER THROUGH FAITH and nothing can separate them from His love. They have been SEALED with the Holy Spirit, who has been given as the GUARANTEE of their salvation, and they are thus ASSURED of an eternal inheritance.

Isaiah 54:10 - “For the mountains may depart and the hills be removed, but My steadfast love shall not depart from you, and My COVENANT OF PEACE shall NOT be removed,’ says the Lord, who has COMPASSION on YOU.”

Jeremiah 32:40 - “I will make with them an EVERLASTING COVENANT, that I will not turn away from DOING GOOD TO THEM. And I will put the fear of Me in their hearts, that they may not turn from Me.”

Matthew 18:12-14 - “What do you think? If a man has a hundred sheep and one of them has gone astray, does he not leave the ninety-nine on the mountains and go in search of the one that went astray? And if he finds it, truly, I say to you, HE REJOICES OVER IT MORE than over the ninety-nine that never went astray. So it is NOT THE WILL OF MY FATHER who is in heaven that ONE of these little ones should perish.”

John 3:16 - “For God so loved the world, that He gave His only Son, that whoever believes in Him SHOULD NOT PERISH but have eternal life.”

I Thessalonians 5:23-24 - “Now may the God of peace Himself sanctify you completely; and may your whole spirit, soul, and body BE PRESERVED BLAMELESS at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. HE WHO CALLS YOU IS FAITHFUL, WHO ALSO WILL DO IT .”

Please go back to my last post and you will find many more. God’s genuine people WILL persevere in the faith. We have the full promise of God about this.

II Timothy 4:18 - “And the Lord WILL DELIVER ME from every evil AND PRESERVE ME FOR HIS HEAVENLY KINGDOM.. To Him be glory forever and ever. Amen!”

To Him BE GLORY FOREVER!

Hebrews 9:12, 15 - “Not with the blood of goats and calves, but with His own blood He entered the Most Holy Place ONCE FOR ALL, having obtained eternal redemption...And for this reason He is the Mediator of the new covenant, by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions under the first covenant, THAT THOSE WHO ARE CALLED MAY RECEIVE “THE PROMISE” OF THE ETERNAL INHERITANCE.”

When it is GOD who does the saving, they may drift away temporarily, but our loving Lord WILL ALWAYS seek them out and bring them back to Himself...

“For thus says the Lord GOD: “Indeed I Myself will search for My sheep and seek them out. 12 As a shepherd seeks out his flock on the day he is among his scattered sheep, so will I seek out My sheep and deliver them from all the places where they were scattered on a cloudy and dark day. 13 And I will bring them out from the peoples and gather them from the countries, and will bring them to their own land; I will feed them on the mountains of Israel, in the valleys and in all the inhabited places of the country.” (Ezek.34:11-13).

“I will make with them an EVERLASTING COVENANT, that I WILL NOT turn away from doing good to them. And I will put the fear of Me in their hearts, that they will not turn from Me.”
(Jer.32:40).

This is the all important difference of being saved in the will of God, and free will. When God saves, His Spirit genuinely indwells them, and if they drift away from Him, and never come back, they were TRULY never His to begin with.

“For our [preaching of the] glad tidings (the Gospel) came to you not only in word, but also in [its own inherent] POWER and IN THE HOLY SPIRIT and WITH GREAT CONVICTION and ABSOLUTE CERTAINTY [on our part].” (I Thes.1:5; Amp. Bible).

Please read what John says below thoughtfully...

I John 5:4, 11-13, 20 - “For whatever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world--our faith...And this is the testimony: that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son. 12 He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life. 13 These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life, and that you may continue to believe in the name of the Son of God....And we know that the Son of God has come and has given us an understanding, that we may know Him who is true; and we are in Him who is true, in His Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God and eternal life.”

Israel (i.e., spiritual Israel, consisting of both Jew and Gentile), can be ASSURED of God’s help when they stumble. Please read Isaiah 41:8-10. “I will UPHOLD YOU with My righteous right hand.” This speaks of His genuine people. Not those who abandon Him forever.

“There is no one who can deliver out of My hand;
I work and who will reverse it?”
(Isa.43:13)

“And I will do all My pleasure,
Calling a bird of prey from the East,
The man who executes My counsel, from a far country.
Indeed I have spoken it;
I will also bring it to pass.
I have purposed it;
I will also do it.”

Listen to Me, you stubborn-hearted,
Who are far from righteousness:
I bring my righteousness near, it shall not be far off;
My salvation shall not delay.
And I will place salvation in Zion,
For Israel My glory.”
(Isa.46:9-13)
Those whom God saves WILL be with Him forever in glory! “I work and who will reverse it?”

I don’t know your name, or even if you are a man or a woman. I can go on and fill many pages with references like all the above. But God is very clear, When it is HE who is doing the saving, His people belong to Him for all eternity. There can be many reasons why they sometimes drift away from Him. But because they belong to Him, He will always seek them out to bring them back into the fold. I am so fond of the following passage from Matthew, because I did drift away from Him for indifference. I was away for a 6-7 year period, and it turned out through very much affliction for a three year period, He brought me back to Himself. It gave me a love for the Lord much greater then before I wandered away. So these words from Matthew that I mentioned above, are very dear to my heart...

Matthew 18:12-14 - “What do you think? If a man has a hundred sheep and one of them has gone astray, does he not leave the ninety-nine on the mountains and go in search of the one that went astray? And if he finds it, truly, I say to you, HE REJOICES OVER IT MORE than over the ninety-nine that never went astray. So it is NOT THE WILL OF MY FATHER who is in heaven that ONE of these little ones should perish.”

I know nothing about you, including spiritually, but I will pray you might take some time and feed on these words I have quoted from God’s promises. It has blessed my own heart, just putting them together for you. I cannot read them often enough.

Bob 

How can one fall away from God if he was never saved? He can't. Thus one can be saved and still become unsaved. In Matthew 24:9-10 it says: ““Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and put you to death, and you will be hated by all nations for my name’s sake. And then many will fall away and betray one another and hate one another. ”

In context we are speaking about saints being persecuted, obviously the world is not hated for His name's sake. 'And then' is specific as to the time and the many who betray and hate are those who had prior to this been in Christ enough to be considered as those who fall away. The danger is real. I am sure you are aware of the many other Scriptures which speak of this peril. Hold fast means don't let go, it is he who endures to the end who will be saved. It would seem that the warning has in it an implicit acknowledgment that some will not.

shalom and love, earl

Sometimes I forget about reading all the replies to my posts, Robert, and though you said this very well, I would just add a bit for more clarification.  YOur statement -

 'And then' is specific as to the time and the many who betray and hate are those who had prior to this been in Christ enough to be considered as those who fall away."

Relating to your words - "been in Christ enough," are those that Hebrews 6, speaks of...

 "For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted the heavenly gift, and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 if they fall away, to renew them again to repentance, since they crucify again for themselves the Son of God, and put Him to an open shame."

It is these Whom the Lord speaks of when He says - Depart from Me, I never knew you.

  They have tasted of these heavenly wonders, but by falling away, they crucify again for themselves the Son of God.
In other words, Christs redeeming power in His death had no affect in these individuals, for these heavenly wonders went no further than the mind, and never reached a heart of flesh, that's responsive to God's touch.  For the heart remained as stone (Ezek.36:26).  The parable of the sower shows how easily deceitfulness can be. 

The Lord spoke to the multitudes in parables with four examples , saying:  “Behold, a sower went out to sow.  And as he sowed, 1)  some seed fell by the wayside; and the birds came and devoured them.  2)  Some fell on stony places, where they did not have much earth; and they immediately sprang up because they had no depth of earth.  But when the sun was up they were scorched, and because they had no root they withered away.  3)  And some fell among thorns, and the thorns sprang up and choked them.  4)  But others fell on good ground and yielded a crop: some a hundred fold, some sixty, some thirty.  He who has ears to hear, let him hear” (Matt.13:3-8).

Then the Lord explains the meaning of his parable, and says...

1)  “When anyone hears the word of the kingdom, and does not understand it, then the wicked one comes and snatches away what was sown in his heart.  This is he who received the seed by the wayside.” 

2)  “But he who received the seed on stony places, this is he who hears the word and immediately receives it with joy; yet he has no root in himself, but endures only for a while.  For when tribulation or persecution arises because of the word, immediately he stumbles.”

3)  “Now he who received the seed among the thorns is he who hears the word, and the cares of this world and the deceitfulness of riches choke the word, and he becomes unfruitful.”

4)  “But he who received the seed on good ground is he who hears the word and understands it, who indeed bears fruit and produces: some a hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.”
(Matt.13:18-23).
   

Why would anybody in his right mind want refuse God's great, wonderful love?       But I guess anything is possible.  But for the grace of God go I.                <>< <3

When I read the scriptures I take it there are those sitting in churches that people think are saved but they are not. They did not get born again. Maybe they said some verses, read, listened but never in their heart got saved. The apostate I believe are those who believe the gospel for a while then when troubles and persecutions happen lose their faith in the gospel. Example: they once repented and beleived in jesus alone for salvation. Then later trouble hits and they no longer believe the true gospel. They may believe a false gospel and revert back to beleifs they had prior. Maybe they now believe all good people are fine regardless of faith. Or one of the other false doctrines out there. Now beleiving fully this false gospel they turn away from walking with the lord. It would have been better for them to not be born then to die in this state. In life as we follow the lord we will have trials, temptations and stumble but must when we see this get back on track and ask forgiveness.life is not always a bed of roses. It does appear to me it is the minority who seem to be following the lord in life. The majority are living with the world's system of right and wrong.

Because of these reasons, Ramone...

Reasons for both physical and spiritual death of mankind...

1. The unregenerate are spiritually dead.
2. The unregenerate cannot repent
3. The unregenerate do not seek God
4. The unregenerate cannot understand or receive spiritual truth
5. The unregenerate are under the power of Satan
6. The unregenerate dwell in darkness
7. The unregenerate are deaf and blind to spiritual truth
8. The unregenerate are helpless
9. The unregenerate have uncircumcised hearts of stone
10. The unregenerate are without hope
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1. Eph.2:1-5; Rom.8:5-8
2. Jer.13:23; II Pet.2:13-14, 22; Rom.8:6-8; Acts 11:18
3. Psalm 14:2-3; Rom.3:11; Rom.1:21-28; 10:20; Isa.65:1
4. John 3:3; I Cor.2:14; 3:20-21
5. II Cor.4:3-4; Acts 26:17-18; JII Tim.2:26; Matt.12:29;
Luke 4:18; II Cor.3:17
6. John 1:4-5; 3:19-20; Rom.1:21, 28; Psa.107:10-16
7. Isa.6:9-10; Mk.4:12; Lk.8:10; Jn.8:43-44, 47;
Pro.20:12
8. Rom.5:6; Ezek.16:69. Acts 7:51; Ezek.44:9; Ezek.11:19; 36:26
10. Eph.2:11-12; I Thes.4:13